Whats a great engine is wasted in an otherwise terrible car?

"LJ909" (lj909) 06/16/2015 at 14:43 • Filed to: None

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Travis’ recent post about the X6 M got me thinking about this. Which cars have great engines wasted in terrible bodies?

jkm7680 > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 14:45

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Terrible body, usually means terrible engine.

Alex B > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 14:46

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The X6M is not a terrible body

450X_FTW > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 14:46

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Winner

not for canada - australian in disguise > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 14:46

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Toyota Corolla XRS

Alfalfa Romeo > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 14:49

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The GM SC V6. Or the NA version. In almost every car they put them in.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 14:49

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Toyota Matrix XRS - Got the amazeballs 2zz motor that Toyota decided we only really want in that and the Celica. Luckily, Lotus found better use for it.

 V8 Rustler > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 14:49

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The 2.3L MZR I4 of the Mazdaspeed3. The engine should’ve been in the Miata from the first day in the NC.

Takuro Spirit > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 14:51

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All aluminum 6.0L LS V8.... in THIS?

Gamecat235 > not for canada - australian in disguise 06/16/2015 at 14:51

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ETA: Your ninja edit makes my response seem silly.

The Corolla S didn’t have the great engine, the XRS did (2ZZ-GE).

And along those lines, it’s the following: Corolla XRS, Matrix XRS, Pontiac Vibe GT.

DoYouEvenShift > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 14:51

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Not tooo terrible. But it does deserve better.

not for canada - australian in disguise > Gamecat235 06/16/2015 at 14:52

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Woops.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 14:53

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the 1.0 Ecoboost in the Fiesta. I mean it’s a good enough car, but why not make it a bit sportier, and why not use that engine in a Miata fighter... What i’m really saying here is, Ford needs a 1.0 powered Miata fighter. “Cuisin’ in my One Point Oh, with my rag top down so my hair can blow.”

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 14:53

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I know I’m going to get flak for this, but the Northstar’s a pretty good little engine that was never really exploited fully. With just a valve-spring change, the stock engine’s good for 8000 RPMs and will fit in many things that wouldn’t normally fit a V8. People have swapped these into Fieros with good results. Instead, GM fitted them to the worst boat-like pieces of shit they could build in the 90s and 2000s, which I think is part of the reason for them getting so much hate.

DoYouEvenShift > Alfalfa Romeo 06/16/2015 at 14:53

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The Australians put it to proper use.

Gamecat235 > not for canada - australian in disguise 06/16/2015 at 14:54

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No worries. I knew what you meant.

Milky > Alfalfa Romeo 06/16/2015 at 14:54

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Wacko > not for canada - australian in disguise 06/16/2015 at 14:55

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that was the same engine as the normal corolla

Wacko > 450X_FTW 06/16/2015 at 14:56

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no way, that is not a waste. go back to the FP you!

:)

Gamecat235 >  V8 Rustler 06/16/2015 at 14:56

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I don’t think you understood the question. Unless your argument is that the Mazda3/Mazdaspeed3 hatch is a terrible car Highway Vehicle Object.

LongbowMkII > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 06/16/2015 at 14:56

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I have no qualms about a compact wagon with a 6spd manual and a 9000rpm redline.

Milky > DoYouEvenShift 06/16/2015 at 14:57

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I’d rather have that supercharged 8 over two turbos and a six.

Gamecat235 > Wacko 06/16/2015 at 14:57

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The XRS twins had the same engine as the Celica GT-S, and the North American Lotus Elise.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > Gamecat235 06/16/2015 at 14:57

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The previous gen Corolla S (not available in NA) had the 4AGE 20v engine, so the point still stands.

 V8 Rustler > Gamecat235 06/16/2015 at 14:58

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It is a terrible car. Should’ve been AWD like the Speed6.

Tekamul > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 14:58

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Saturn Vue Red Line

Honda’s stellar (at the time) J35 stuffed into one of GM’s badge engineered cross overs.

Blegh

450X_FTW > Wacko 06/16/2015 at 14:59

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Saying I have GT-R and the great thing is that it’s looks like a Juke is like saying I’m married to a supermodel and the great thing is she looks like Piers Morgan

not for canada - australian in disguise > Wacko 06/16/2015 at 14:59

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Corolla S had the normal Corolla engine.

Wacko > Gamecat235 06/16/2015 at 14:59

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his original post was the corolla S

AthomSfere > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 14:59

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Audi R8 with the V10...

DoYouEvenShift > Milky 06/16/2015 at 15:00

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Read my mind.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > LongbowMkII 06/16/2015 at 15:00

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Me neither. It’s just weird that Toyota didn’t do anything with it. It’s like Yamaha got back from their R&D lab and Toyota was like “remember how we wanted a good engine? Well, we lied” and just put the 1zz in everything instead. The 2ZZ should have been Toyota’s opening shots at Honda, but then both companies decided that they just want to be boring.

Gamecat235 > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 06/16/2015 at 15:01

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They were in non-Levin models? That’d make for a nice sleeper.

TheHondaBro > Gamecat235 06/16/2015 at 15:01

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The Celica was unwound and it’s heart was found in the XRS. (Props if you get the reference)

Gamecat235 >  V8 Rustler 06/16/2015 at 15:03

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I don’t really agree. They carved out a nice niche in the market and ran with it. The speed3 was so much more successful than the speed6, and I think that cost was a factor there.

Brian Silvestro > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 15:04

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How is that engine wasted if it’s also used in the M5, M6, and X5 M?

DoYouEvenShift > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 06/16/2015 at 15:04

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They were overshadowed by the enormous success of the LS. STS was a decent car.

Saracen > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 15:05

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The Juke’s turbo 1.6 really should be in a proper lightweight RWD sports car...not a hideous crossover.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > Gamecat235 06/16/2015 at 15:06

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Looks like it -

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie >  V8 Rustler 06/16/2015 at 15:07

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Ever drive one?

LongbowMkII > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 06/16/2015 at 15:08

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emissions have really killed off the high strung n/a 4cyl. a civic si only goes to 7k.

RallyWrench > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 15:09

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VW VR6 in Eurovans.

LongbowMkII > 450X_FTW 06/16/2015 at 15:09

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^ He’s right you know

DoYouEvenShift > Takuro Spirit 06/16/2015 at 15:09

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Fancy TBSS!

LongbowMkII > Takuro Spirit 06/16/2015 at 15:10

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works for me. Always a sucker for a unicorn.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 06/16/2015 at 15:10

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I once test drove a 98 DeVille even tho that car would have been a VERY odd choice for me, just because it had a V8 and was in my limited budget. But it was soooo slow and boring to drive. it was like driving a slow boat, while sitting in a big leather couch. I ended yup buying a 99 Civic EX instead because it felt faster. whether of not is was slow or faster didn’t really matter to me.

correction I think it was a 2000 Deville if I remember right it had the big happy headlights. this face is way to cute for a Cadillac

Dsscats > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 15:13

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HHear me out on this one. The EK9 itself is a very good car, but the high revving I4 with good power and decent torque DESERVES to be in something mid engined.

Takuro Spirit > LongbowMkII 06/16/2015 at 15:13

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A fat, ugly, nose-jobbed GM unicorn is still a waste.

Dsscats > AthomSfere 06/16/2015 at 15:14

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The Audi R8 is a fantastic car.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > LongbowMkII 06/16/2015 at 15:15

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I thought that at least in that example, it was because of the increased stroke of the K24 vs the K20. The K20 still goes to the mid-8s depending on the car they put it in. That’s weird that it would be an emissions thing unless that means that they need to tune it differently down low. It’s not like they bounce it off of the rev limiter when they do their tests. That’s why so many turbo engines advertise such better numbers than they get. They’re designed with the test in mind.

Wacko > 450X_FTW 06/16/2015 at 15:18

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this is the internet I am right you are wrong.

Good day sir,

I said good day.

Drives off again in my CLS63

SR20, It’s legit, don’t let my personalized plates fool you

LJ909 > jkm7680 06/16/2015 at 15:19

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Not always. But most of the time yes.

jkm7680 > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 15:20

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yis

Snuze: Needs another Swede > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 15:21

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GM’s LUJ 1.4L Turbo 4 cylinder. This little engine is great, especially with just a mild tune, it loves to play and packs a midrange punch. Great for a hot city commuter or sporty roadster. Belongs in a lightweight like a Mazda2 or a Miata. Instead saddled with a 3300lbs behemoth of a Cruze (relatively speaking of course).

Wacko > 450X_FTW 06/16/2015 at 15:21

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but really there is no truth to what you just said not with the pic you posted. The GTR engine/drive-train is what makes this juke so right. I would rather have the Juke-R that a GTR.

LJ909 > Alex B 06/16/2015 at 15:21

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Looks wise maybe not to some people but it is to be an M car. It’s heavy, has too much lean in corners and has brake dive.

JawzX2, Boost Addict. 1.6t, 2.7tt, 4.2t > not for canada - australian in disguise 06/16/2015 at 15:23

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THIS.

LongbowMkII > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 06/16/2015 at 15:23

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I could be wrong, but generally in order to get a lot of power at high rpms the efficiency and cleanliness suffers at low rpms. Instead of having to spin that 2.0 at 8k to make ~200hp (and have slightly dirtier tests) you can spin a 2.4 at 7k and meet standards more inexpensively.

dogisbadob > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 06/16/2015 at 15:29

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That Matrix/Vibe is awesome though. Lots of space, under 3000 lb, classic Toyota reliability.

Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 15:29

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The 2.0T in the Malibu when it could be in a Cruze SS or Sonic SS.

dogisbadob > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 15:30

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The Caliber SRT4. Basically a FWD Evo, but even 330 hp isn’t enough to overcome its fugliness and low quality construction

PS9 > Alex B 06/16/2015 at 15:34

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Terrible to look at? Nah. It’s not hideous or anything.

Terrible execution? Absolutely. A bad sports car because it’s a giant and a sports car should be small. A bad SUV because that dumb-for-an-SUV sloping roofline kills cargo space. Bad as a car because that sloping roofline and caved in sports car greenhouse kill visibility and hamper practicality, and you don’t get any sports car-like returns for those sacrifices because it’s so big and massive. It’s also bad offroad because of the low profile sports car inspired street tires, but that’s not really a body issue.

Speed. Sporty Looks. Cargo Space. Room for passengers. Sporty handling. You don’t even have to leave the BMW padock to get an option at this price range that does two or three of those things much better than the X6 tries to. By trying to be a jack of all trades, it gets to be master of none, and it’s all because of that terribly executed body.

nafsucof > Milky 06/16/2015 at 15:39

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But the gt has a Daytona prototype race motor. It doesn’t need a larger heavier v8 to make 600-700 hp.

Milky > nafsucof 06/16/2015 at 16:02

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“Doesn’t need” doesn’t mean I wouldn’t like. Also thats assuming they couldn't get more HP from that V8 with a budget thats more super car and not Mustang.

Wacko > not for canada - australian in disguise 06/16/2015 at 16:03

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I know that’s why I said it’s the same engine, when you first posted the Corolla S and not the XRS.

The S in corolla S was for slow, since it was the same car as the base model, but with more plastic ground effects and bigger wheels and better stereo = heaver car.

If you make any mistake on car facts, someone will correct you quickly over here.

AM > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 16:20

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GM’s 2.0L EcoTec Diesel engine. Amazing little engine with good hp, great torque and excellent mpgs. But of course GM being GM, the only way you can get it is by purchasing this pile of shit

Nobi > Alfalfa Romeo 06/16/2015 at 16:22

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You ever drive a w-body with one of them? Not too shabby. Only thing holding it back(besides front wheel drive) was the made-of-glass transmission. I wish when the GTO came back in ‘04 they made a blacked out one for buick and resurrected the Grand National. Like DoYouEvenShift said, the Aussies already did all the hard work.

Bytemite > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 06/16/2015 at 16:36

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I’m so pissed they didn’t put the 190 hp 2zz into the ZZW30. It was the only car to deserve that engine and they decided those front drive grocery getters needed it more!?

However...I still want the ZZW30 because of its layout and weight. What’s your opinion of the 3rd gen? I am looking for one because all the 1st gens are hidden away now..

LJ909 >  V8 Rustler 06/16/2015 at 16:38

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I totally agree. But I had heard that it was way to heavy for the Miata.

LJ909 > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 06/16/2015 at 16:43

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It was a great engine. But what killed it off was that it was expensive to build for GM and to maintain. Ask any owner of any Northstar powered car. My cousin had a 2002 STS and he had Mercedes level repair bills. It was crazy.

LJ909 > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles 06/16/2015 at 16:45

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I dont think the 1.0 would work in a Miata fighter. Probably a kei car yes, like the Ford KA, but we would never get that here.

LJ909 > AthomSfere 06/16/2015 at 16:45

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Seriously?

LJ909 > AM 06/16/2015 at 16:46

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Good point. And its almost 30 grand. Thats alot of coin for a Cruze. I would take it if it were in the Sonic.

LJ909 > Snuze: Needs another Swede 06/16/2015 at 16:47

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Exactly. Its more enjoyable in the Sonic but it needs to be in some sort of Kappa successor.

LJ909 > Tekamul 06/16/2015 at 16:48

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I totally forgot that Honda used their V6 for the Vue Redline. Always thought that was kind of weird.

LJ909 > Brian Silvestro 06/16/2015 at 16:50

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Because its in the X6. Its the equivalent of Chrysler putting a 6.4 Hemi in a Town & Country.

450X_FTW > Wacko 06/16/2015 at 16:56

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Juke with GTR powertrain is like wanting a Jeep Cherokee with a Hellcat engine it. no thanks.

AM > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 17:07

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The diesel definitely comes at a premium, it's especially high priced for the outdated Cruze. They should add some more diesel models, that could probably help boost sales of the Malibu and the Sonic granted they don’t charge too much for them as well.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 17:17

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It’s not too far off of the power number the ND is putting down.

ND: 155hp, 148ft/lbs

Fiesta: 123HP, 148ft/lbs

So yes it has less power, but a potential weight advantage(for example the base curb weight of the 1.0 is almost 100lbs less than the 1.6l not all of that is the engine tho, i’m sure), and just the quirky-ness of a little three pot sports car. Would it need to be small? Yes. Is that a bad thing? Nope.

Also since It would need to make 45mpg in a sports car I’m sure Ford could extract a few more ponies out of the little thing.

Brian Silvestro > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 17:24

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I still don’t understand. It’s not like that engine ONLY goes in the X6. It’s being put to good use in very good cars, aka NOT wasted

Wacko > 450X_FTW 06/16/2015 at 17:27

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Thanks, now I want a Cherokee with a hell cat.

Just stop dude, you are just making it worse

LJ909 > Brian Silvestro 06/16/2015 at 17:31

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Yea I don’t think you do understand my point. I’m saying that every X6 M that’s made is one less that could be used in an M5 or M6. I know its used in other applications but something being put to use in the wrong way is still wasteful.

Brian Silvestro > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 17:37

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But if they didn’t make the X6 M that engine wouldn't be made at all. There would simply be less 4.4L engines.

Bill"TheStig"Murray > Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer 06/16/2015 at 20:30

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Yes! It’s so weird that Chevy is willing to let Ford be the only American sport compact manufacturer.

BaconSandwich is tasty. > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles 06/16/2015 at 20:50

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I so wish they offered the 1.0L as a crate engine. I’d buy several, if not just for kicks.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > Bytemite 06/16/2015 at 21:35

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Third gen was a return to basics. It’s about the same weight as the AW11. The chassis is great.

AthomSfere > Dsscats 06/16/2015 at 22:34

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Technically, its good enough. But the V10 version is essentially a rebadged Gallardo with none of the Gallardo charm and all the Audi boringness. Its like a LS swap in a Chevy Celebrity, cool in a way but why bother?

AthomSfere > LJ909 06/16/2015 at 22:37

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Yes, seriously. Audi makes nothing that interests me. The R8, although I love the idea of it with a big engine mounted in the right spot... Then I see an R8 and I get sleepy, like “Oh, another Ax, Sx, Jetta, Passat something some some...thing... zzzzzzz”.

With the V10 specifically I think, that could have been a Gallardo, and I get pissy.

LJ909 > AthomSfere 06/17/2015 at 01:02

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You do have a point so I can’t get mad. I feel the same way about Porsche.

boxrocket > LJ909 06/17/2015 at 01:17

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I’m not a fan of the modern SBC, but I do have respect for it, so the C7 and Camaro SS. In the same vein, the SSR and GTO with the 6.0, Hellcat Challenger, Cobalt SS, Noble M600 (to a point), Gumpert Apollo, Caparo T1 (the purple race car for the road that kept falling part or catching fire when Jeremy drove it on the Top Gear Test Track), old muscle cars, etc.

pip bip - choose Corrour > DoYouEvenShift 06/17/2015 at 06:36

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been retro fitted to so many things , so many times.

 V8 Rustler > Gamecat235 06/18/2015 at 23:09

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A FWD Muscle hatchback.

 V8 Rustler > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 06/18/2015 at 23:09

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No

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie >  V8 Rustler 06/19/2015 at 07:26

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Then you don’t know what you’re talking about. The Speed3’s pretty great.

Amoore100 > LJ909 08/03/2015 at 19:22

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Honda J35 wasted in a body of 2000’s era GM plastic...

CCC (formerly CyclistCarCoexist) > not for canada - australian in disguise 09/28/2015 at 22:45

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I agree, but it's a damn fine improvement.